chris wilkinson

PMSL Dom You Need the horse before the cart OMG

Chris has done a fine job with the new bits dont like them dont buy them simple or should we all go round in fury hats and long grey coats and all have the same for breakfast and drive the same car to work and all work at the same place PMSL
Correct me not are you not the king of Ebay second hand stuff

No you are, of course right Paul I know nothing that's why you asked me to be a mod on here?????
Again I haven't ever run various successful rc clubs and set up tracks like gaydon back in the day for 12th nationals I haven't raced and won in most classes that use battery power and raced and pushed mardaves as the best club class for years.
Nevermind the fact I hate moving forward so much I entered the supadave national circuit series and won which allowed mods even mardave didnt make pmsl.

I state simple truthful fact and a point of view that may not be my own but is one that should if not must be considered especially if mardave is to last another 25 years.
Which I hope it does more than someone who has only just discovered the joys of the class after being so negative towards them for so long.

End of my comments and involvement with this thread.
P.s chris if you read this keep up the good work.

Admin wrote:
Correct me not are you not the king of Ebay second hand stuff

yes paul, because unlike some i cant afford luxuries like new tyres

Some thoughts on 'Little Kid X'...

One of the many things I love about the V12 chassis is that all parts can be inter-changed. Assuming that the new parts and chassis will have this feature too then, in my view, it makes the car even more appealing to new drivers, not less.

Say Little Kid X (or Big Kid Y for that matter) wants to start racing. He or she is not likely to be in a position to throw large sums of cash at all the new gear but a Mardave V12 'Club' or 'Race' kit is likely to be affordable. Add to that a simple 27MHz radio set, a couple of batteries and charger and he or she is good to go. They can then go to their local club and get advice on setup (ride height, use of additives and tires etc) and with just these simple adjustments they can get a very sweet handling car. It is also unlikely that they are going to be naturally tallented at racing so the odd crash in inevetable, and crashes lead to occasional breakages which leads to repairs and knowledge of how the car goes together. They are sooooo simple that doing such repais can only be a good learning experience. Parts for the basic cars are also cheap so this in not likept to break the bank...

No fast forward a few months. X or Y has still got the racing bug, they are getting to grips with the driving and want to 'go faster'. In my experience, faster speeds only generate bigger crashes and more frequent/expensive repairs. If repairs become too frequent and therefore too expensive the driver is likely to be put off. Of course, this is not definite, just more likely than not.

So, 'going faster' is not the way. How about translating this to 'better handling'? If the chassis upgrades can be interchanged then X or Y can buy the new parts as and when they can and these will (hopefully) make their car handle better. If it drives better then they will do better in the races and get the impression they are 'going faster'. They have some basic skill now so can appreciate how these parts change the car. This is better than adding them straight off, spending money and not appreciating the changes.

Of course, if they loose the bug they have not spent a fortune and should be able to sell the gear on.

The only thing I would advise is that we try to keep a similar power/grip level that we currently have. Even a modified V12 has more grip than power and this is why driving them really can be called 'racing'. I've seen too many touring car drivers bolt on the fastest and best bits to make their cars like rocket ships, and these simply bounce off all the track markers on every single lap. This is not racing - it is surviving from one corner to the next. Unless, of course you break something (again!) and retire. My local club has recently introduced a 17.5t maximum motor wind for TC racing for just this reason. Several 'top' drivers have even dopped to a 21.5t motor. As a result cars are slower in a straight line but drivers complete more laps and smile more often as they really challenge eachother and race for real.

One more thing. Having hand built several 1/12 circuit cars over the years as well as several 1/10 WGT types and SuperDaves, the thing I like about the V12 is its wheelbase and track widths. It is relatively long and narrow which makes the car far less twitchy and more predictable to drive than a 1/12 circuit car. A modified 1/12 circuit car needs to be twitchy and wide to cope with the higher cornering speeds of modified motors, and this is why they HAVE to be built and setup accurately and carefully. Which takes the time. A WGT is almost as fast but its bigger size and 'narrower' relative track width makes it far easier to drive, just like a V12. With mine I built it exactly as kit and, as long as I kept an eye on tire diameter and ride height, the only thing I changed on the setup was tire compound and additives. Of course, all three are rear wheel drive and have foam tires which, I believe, is the only real way to build a proper model race car.

As I said before, bring on these changes and new parts. Make then interchangable so a driver can start with a basic chassis and upgrade over time. Keep foam tires and limits on motor and battery power. Keep the track and wheelbase of the V12 the same. Keep them rear wheel drive. Allow the class to grow!

James

Brilliant post james
All point are well covered in your last post, yes the class will grow as long as there are restrictions
and as long as they stay as fun as they are to drive. I hope it doesnt start to move 2 piece chassis and having a link system ect as it will move the class to far away for where it started and making the old mardave parts obsolete, making it to much like a pancar.

As per most on here good and Bad points but as Per Jimbo its all down to handeling and cost

so lets see what people are after and why

Well a better handiling car is what we all want the better it handles the more enjoyment you get out out of it the more you want to do it again so

Chassis is I think £5

Kid X has a big crash car handles like pants ally chassis is twisted and he does not know or realise its happened goes to one more meeting and car still bad . . . Result Kid X packs up and says its crap

remedy some will be lucky enough to know some drivers that will see the problem and put it right so kid buys another chassis and is racing again

So thats why we wanted GRP chassis but they need to be about 3mm wider each side to take the Cobra battery box so the screws into the chassis are not on the edge

Also as kids grow up and start racing you all missing the main thing that kids do . . . they grow and notice GIRLS

I am 51 and I have seen this happen oh so many times and then they leave the sport and come back into it later on in life hence from 13 to 21 there thin on the ground and out pubs clubs etc

So in a way the next thing is cost and the Dave has always been a low cost race car but we seem to be moving away from this and as I have said I cant justify £43 for an alloy block sorry I wont pay and like Dom the 2nd hand market on ebay is how a lot of people support the hobby and I WILL get the 1/12th or GT one now and mod it to fit the dave or at least try because for £27 its cheaper

And Yea Chris got ya Pm will call you Monday

Tomo wrote:
As for mardave r and d I love the mardave g2 brushless and have run mine in everything and it's out lasted how many systems of yours Gazza?

Well lets see LRP A.I crap Fusion pluged in wrong way round Team wave wont work on 1s and tekin is mega but new rules say no turbo or boost so ESC now is GTB2 Tomo but motor is still going strong


that is but then again I raced my Dave 90% More than you and you race it once in a blue moon so I have done a lot more meetings than yours

I think the same as James people as they get better will want to buy the hop up parts. on the same foot it gives the senior racer the chance to hop up as well. It has been stated in a earlier post that the kids well Gazza put it in context kids come and go just like anything else dedicated kids will stay and progress to take it to another level.

For the life of me i cannot understaqnd some people Chris has started to make progress taking the dave to another level and this can only be good for the hobby and the future of the car. I dont think like Dom thinks that the chassis will go to a two piece chassis nut again the new bits are going to be sought after we all know that. Me i take my advice from Gazza about the mardave he has run one longer than anyone and knows them inside out not just a shoot and squirt merchant but a guy who understands the fundementals we can all go flat out to be the fastest but from what i see of that they dont normaly ever finish a race.

this is a debate not a argument just a debate on how things are moving forward with this car

Gaza I race mine week in week out and the same system in my f1s week in week out and no problems ever.
Agree the gtb2 is an awesome bit of kit though as is the tekin.
Do u still have a Dave Gaz?

sold me old on ( rolling chassis )

But still got me out side dave and all electrics to fit in another when im ready to re start

Why did you sell it Gaz?

may sound like a dig at people but not intending . .

Simple fed up of waiting for rules and the like to be sorted hence people sold there cars & like others why carry on there is no point its taking way to long and it is trust me. . .

so still not bothered on running one hence im running GT as we all know where we stand rule wise etc

To be fair the rules haven't changed it's what the club you race at chooses to implement.
The brca has set processes that are being followed and the time scale is determined by that fact.

I know you love Dave racing same as me, and you still have all the same gear you ran before so why not go get another one and get back to trading places with james as that's when I've seen you happiest

To be Fair tho Tomo how far have we got since forming the commettiee . . . as far as every one can see just what James has done and thats it.

But I run GT the rules are the same at every club because we have rules . . .

as for "what the club you race at chooses to implement.""

thats simple we dont see GT drivers turn up with a 6.5 and 2s lipo do we because we know its either 17.5 and 2s or 10.5 and 1s Job done

I Just run to the BRCA rumoured rules, as a superdave regardless of the club, then at least as / when the rules come in I'm ready. Still manage to lap well and have good races without canabalising the car for each meeting depending upon which club it runs at.

Any way a chat to Chris this morning re the price and its down to good ole British company's trying to survive and the cost is as it is which is a shame as Chris says proud to be made in England