World GT racing at the Snowbirds

I realise how fortunate I am to have been able to race r/c cars in some amazing places around the world. It isn't like I'm a potential world champion or sponsored factory driver, but just someone who enjoys racing and the fun to be had combining racing abroad with holidays.

This isn't the forum to talk about the 12th European and World championship meetings I've been to, or the Tamiya Eurocup finals I travelled to. You've already seen the Vegas IIC thread, but there is one meeting I'd read about every year and wanted to race at. The Snowbirds in Orlando, Florida.

What was it about that meeting? Well it was partly the sheer size of the meeting which covers a massive number of both on-road and oval classes. Partly an 18-hour a day racing schedule that means you race at odd times of the day and night. And partly because I thought that being able to pit from your room in the hotel sounded very cool.

So Mrs B and I had one of those "where else do you want to go?" conversations and I mentioned the Snowbirds and Florida. And shortly afterwards the 2011 dates were releases and she had sorted the flights, hotels and all I had to do was enter. This is one of the many reasons I married her

So what was it like?

This was the 17th year the Snowbirds had been run in Florida, and just like Scotty and the IIC crew these guys have got the meeting running like clockwork. I've only been to two meetings I'd say were better organised...both were run in the UK by the BRCA (1998 On Track worlds, and the Hinckley 12th Euros last year).

Mrs B had booked a larger room with a seperate living room so any early starts to my pit work didn't disturb her. This proved to be very wise as the World GT class was first up and I typically raced between 07:00 and 07:20 am. To cram a practice in meant a 6am start.

Pitting in your hotel room was as cool as I thoujght it would be. Channel 66 on the hotel got a feed from the track, although I quickly found the hotel's free wi-fi had a more reliable internet feed. That said the main pits looks lively and fun, and spots there only cost $25 for the week.

The track was really well thought out. Which it had to be for one on which so many different classes would be run. It was a challenged for World GT, looked good for all the Touring car classes and was the first multi-class track where I'd wanted to race 12th classes as well. Then when the on-road classes were done it was convered into an oval with large plastic "D" sections either end, and two parallel rails down the middle.

Large US meetings tend to run to a different format. A couple of days of practice, then a couple of days of qualifying then it all comes down to one final. My aim was simple - keep out of the last final, and get as close to the B-main as I could. The top 9 racers go straight into the A-main, 10th qualifier has to race in the B-mail (and gets the "BQ-screw" trophy) together with places 11 through 19. And the winner of the B-main gets bumped up to 10th place in the A-main.

I've never really enjoyed practice, but did have some new things to get used to. This was my first serious running with a World GT car fitted with in-line blocks for more steering, first time using anything other that CS-Grip additive (not one of the four legal additives for this meeting) and I'd have to work out gearing and speedo set up for a 13.5 motor rather than the 10.5 motors we use in the UK.

This meant I needed some new kit to run with. First day after travelling we drove over to Superior Hobbies in Castleberry. Takes about 30 minutes from the Radisson hotel in which the Snowbirds are held. It was a mightly impressive shop, and I quikcly found the additive I wanted (SCX v3.0 was I'd picked up the one to use). Plus some shoo-go for body repairs. And a 13.5 motor (Trinity Epic Duo 2). And a 65c Thunder Power LiPo. Plus some motor cleaner (never fly with this, I always buy it when I get there and leave it behind). The prices were very good, and then we got 10% discount as a Snowbirds racer.

Practice used a really neat system for recording times. You registered on the FastCats system with your names and personal transponder number. And got a printed barcode to stick on your transmitter.

At the end of each run you went back to the system and scanned the barcode. Which would allow you to see the times and print them off on a thermal printer, like a till roll. Every lap time was there, plus your best 5,10 and 15 laps. As I was experimenting with speedo settings a lot, this proved very handy to track if I was faster or not.

I'll post more about the World GT class, some photos and a report on qualifying and racing later.

What's triggered this post...? Well we enjoyed the meeting and spending time in Florida during late Jan/early Feb when it's really cold in the UK. So we're going back for the 18th Snowbirds which have just been announced will be 31st Jan to 5th Feb in 2012.

i would love to do something like this!!!

dazzler wrote:i would love to do something like this!!!

Yes Daz you would

There are two World GT and F1 classes at the IIC in Vegas this year. Classes have yet to be announced for the Snowbirds...there will be a World GT class, but too early to say about an F1 class. I suspect if enough of the UF1 runners in the States were interested it could be on.

The time on track is surprisingly low, but you're talking 40-50 heats per round for the IIC and more for on-road and then oval at the Snowbirds.

I know of at least two other Brits racing in GT and 12th classes in Vegas.

You know you want to...

I think vagas is a little out on my reach.. but what an ace adventure

So packing before a meeting you have to fly to is something that gets easier over time. It is actually far less hassle getting racing kit through airport security than you might think. Just be sensible - pack LiPos in a LiPo sack, disconnect batteries, include something relating to the meeting. And wrap anything delecate in bubble wrap, and pack it tight with t-shirts and shoes.

I have flow with a big hauler bag, but now moved on to a decent suitcase. I have a mid-sized hard case which has tough polycarbonate as a shell. A zipped fabric divider keeps two halves seperate and stops too much movement within the case. It's got the odd knock, but is doing well and with a handle and wheels is a breeze to move around airports and hotels.

Spoke to Andy Moore at the Union Square race and he keeps a racing bag packed ready for any fly away meeting. It has everything he needs to race. Sensible for someone who goes to worldwide races on a regular basis.

Me...well I just thinkg carefully about what I need. As someone once said to me take every bodyshell you plan to race, and a spare of it just in case. Didn't do that at the IIC and regretted not taking a Sophia. So for the Snowbirds I had my faithful red and white shell, plus a fast new purple and white shell sprayed for me by Gav Clinch (GavGrafix and a top chap all around).

I didn't pack a tyre truer even though I knew World GT would use BSR Lilac control tyres that had to be bought at the meeting. Figured I find someone in the 12th/GT/Oval pit to borrow a truer from, as they are heavy and bulky to carry for 10-15 mins work. A certain Josh Cyrul came up trumps on the day I needed one...more arbours that I've ever seen, and an outstanding finish from the cutting bit. Great chat with 12th and oval guys in the outdoor truing area made a boring task more entertaining

World GT class was 13.5 and whilst I had an old school Speed Passion motor, knew the Epic Duo 2 was the one to have. So would buy that there. Same for additive...four allowed, of which I only had Jack The Gripper. I know that's ok when it is the only one allowed, but isn't as good as others. A bit of digging found SXT 3.0 was the one to go for so one more thing to buy there. I also won't fly with motor cleaner so that was on the list. As was a new LiPo, and a small shopping list from Mr Winton

Tekin Hotwire and Netbook for programming were going to key as I knew I'd be tuning for 13.5 motor. A 10.5 I had sorted but this would take lower RPMs and a re-think on boost and turbo settings.

Packed one set of tyres. Car was wrapped up in lots of bubble wrap, plus carbon spares (thanks Jason!). I cut down on my tools as they are bulky and some were in the box from 12th racing. One GM power supply and dual-charger would simplify LiPo and LiFE Rx charging.

I have a bag for my 3VCS transmitter that fits it snugly. Some extra bubble wrap and remembering to unplug the battery were the only othter things to remember.

As I raced at the Plymouth 12th national the weekend before flying out to Florida, it was just as well the packing took very little time. As I wasn't home much in between the two

wicked, what was the quality of racing like compared to the uk?

So onto practice...

As I mentioned before for me the Snowbirds experience was all about pitting in your hotel room. The organisers had laid out timetables for each day so you knew when each round was due to start and finish.

The live feed to channel 66 on the hotel room TVs was very cool

Our "living" section of the hotel room had a very sturdy table and swivel office chair. Very comfortable and perfect for a pit table

I'd downloaded some Associated 10R5 set up sheets and a Tekin RS set up from the respective web sites. Those would do for starters...actually the 10R5 set up was pretty close to my previous set up. I'd been loaned a set of inline steering blocks to fit, and had done that the week before at Plymouth.

Practice was in class, and World GT was up first. So I didn't expect much grip for the first run...and I was right!

The track was good to drive, with a fairly tight infield section which when you got used to it had a flow to it. A right-left-right section led onto the straight and even though grip was low I could tell more punch was needed to get up to speed quikcly after the slower corner. A sweeper off the end of the straight would need some work to get the line right.

The inline blocks gave a lot more steering then I'd had before. A touch more wouldn't hurt so I changed the Associated Gold centre spring for a harder Red one.

There were two days of practice, with GTs on first that meant 7am for the first run. I decided the only way to work up the learning curve for 13.5 and Tekin RS settings was to change something every run. So over each run the start and end RPMs came down, the Turbo and Boost got a bit more aggressive and I worked on roll into the corner. Hadn't used that brushless before where drag brake is more usual...but an old brushed speedo had it and it helped carry more corner speed.

With 40+ heats the grip came up and by the second pracitce day a drak grey addtiive line started to appear.

We were asked to pre-Tech all 13.5 motors that we planned to use (same for 17.5 classes). The ROAR meeting earlier that month had seen rumours of hand wound spec motors, so each motor was resiistence checked when cold and out of the car. I'd seen the checker unit before, and both of mine passed. They were then sealed with yellow paint on the end of the main screws, and a prizmatic sticker and UV pen was used to make pre-race Tech easier with a black light.

Practice done I was feeling pretty good with my set up and ready to race. Two sets of tyres bought and trued, super glue on the edge of the fronts and we were good to go.

Next update will be qualifying, the cool onsite rc shop in a hotel room, and some photos.

dazzler wrote:wicked, what was the quality of racing like compared to the uk?

The 5am-7am practice was 2 minute runs and open classes. So World GTs were out with 12th cars who were ok to run with, and touring cars from mod to spec to the Amatuer class. Not much free track to run, and easy to get tangled up in other accidents.

As practice was to test something I'd not run before I only needed a couple of decent laps to know how it worked. Then back to the room to fit a charged LiPo, fresh tyres and get the motor cooled down. My heat was usually just after 7am so had to use the time wisely.

The heats are re-seeded after every qualifying round. This does mean a potentially different heat, start number and start time. But does mean that by rounds 3 and 4 your are running with people at your pace. Actually the final round 4 was pretty much the main final I'd be running with. They were very clean and pretty disciplined, with only light amounts of calling faster cars through. No formal refs.

With all the practice and running qualifiers against the clock, the only real race is the one main final. I got inside the car that started in front of me and got nudged when I went for the move. Put me at the back of the pack, and I worked hard to get back to 4th and on the tail of 3rd place (annoying - I've had the pace on him all weekend, and got the leader between us so couldn't rudely push past).

So racing in the heats very clean. The mains a bit less so. However I'm told the B-main finals with the 10th place A-main grid spot up for grabs get brutal.

Saturday night is always something fun. This year was a lights out oval race, with green lasers tracking the cars. And a figure-8 destruction derby. There are videos of these on the Snowbirds site, and well worth watching.

Fran and I had plans for Saturday night so didn't make those two races. But next February we may just have to take them in,

Don't expect me to take up oval racing though. I respect the guys who do it, and one chat with a racer who explained he ran a different foam tyre on every corner was enough. A very steep learning curve

Not long now until the 2012 Snowbirds classes are announced.

I'm secretly hoping for an F1 class, but after that was included by Scotty for the IIC I think it's unlikely Mike Bolan will do the same for the Snowbirds. Especially as he's added VTA - the US class running American muscle car shells...mmm nice

Expect there will be one World GT class. May be open speedos...may not. Will get high grip after that many heats lay additive down so giving serious thought to how I cope with that. Let's just say I have a plan

If the GT class isn't run then I'd look seriously at 12th. Would prefer not to as the tyres needed for 12th take up a lot more space. World GT running control tyres means I literally only have to take one set for practice, and buy the rest out these (at a very good price I might add!)

More when the classes are announced

markb wrote:Not long now until the 2012 Snowbirds classes are announced.

Expect there will be one World GT class. May be open speedos...may not. Will get high grip after that many heats lay additive down so giving serious thought to how I cope with that. Let's just say I have a plan

Might be able to help you there Cheese DoRi5 10 being cut at the moment

Jason

jasonb wrote:Might be able to help you there Cheese DoRi5 10 being cut at the moment

Jason

Thanks Jason

I remember the plans for the D12....but loving the DoRi5 10 name...cunning

Not convinced my original parts for in line are sensble. The shock mount is ok, but the chassis is kit and so doesn't have the right holes for cell mounting.

Fran had been speaking to Josh in Vegas, but got choices with DoRi5 10 now.

Hmmmm

High Cheese,
Is this what you had in mind? Stiffer chassis that will take inline cells 1s and 2s as well as standard cell position. Stiffer front suspension riser, tube dampers and longer centre shock.

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That looks fantastic Jason nice job will this chassis be available to purchase please

some one nicked ya picture

Gazza wrote:some one nicked ya picture

Well I can see it?

Si wrote:That looks fantastic Jason nice job will this chassis be available to purchase please

Should be available from AMC sometime next month

Jason

all i got is this . . .

High Cheese,
Is this what you had in mind? Stiffer chassis that will take inline cells 1s and 2s as well as standard cell position. Stiffer front suspension riser, tube dampers and longer centre shock.

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That looks brilliant Jason
How much will it cost roughly?

HB-Dom wrote:That looks brilliant Jason
How much will it cost roughly?

Not quite sure yet but will be competitive with the price of AE parts.

Jason

jasonb wrote:High Cheese,
Is this what you had in mind? Stiffer chassis that will take inline cells 1s and 2s as well as standard cell position. Stiffer front suspension riser, tube dampers and longer centre shock.

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The DoRi5 10 looks the business built up Jason

Side damper tubes are a nice touch to replace the centre shock. It's primarily the battery slots and retainers for in-line cells that won't work on the stock chassis. Seen the RC Devil conversion which adds more weight higher up to do it. Bad times!

I need to see the Snowbirds classes before decided what to race there. It's 95% likely to be World GT, in which case an in-line chasis to cope with mega high grip carpet will be in order

Classes should be out sometime this week, and entries open around US Thanksgiving.

Need to speak to Wim about some F1 bits, so will see how he's getting on the Josh and CEFX at the same time.

jasonb wrote:

Si wrote:That looks fantastic Jason nice job will this chassis be available to purchase please

Should be available from AMC sometime next month

Jason

Thanks for the info Jason I'll keep my eye out for it

Snowbirds classes are out:

TOURING AMATEUR 17.5 - blinky speedos, Spec tyres, Strictly for amateurs only: no sponsored racers, etc,

TOURING STOCK 17.5 - blinky speedos, Spec tyres

TOURING EXPERT 17.5 - open speedos, Spec tyres

TOURING MODIFIED - open speeds, Spec tyres

1/12th GTP 17.5 - blinky speedos

1/12th GTP 13.5 - open speedos

1/12th GTP MODIFIED - open speedos

WORLD GT 13.5 - ROAR motors / 1S LiPos, Non-timing "blinky" speedo rule, Spec CRC/BSR Lilac tyres,

U.S. VINTAGE TRANS AM - Using the USVTA official rules, Bring your own HPI spec tires,
Novak 25.5 motors / Roar 2S 5000mah limit.

And of course the Oval classes

I really liked the look of the 'Birds track for 12th as it looked more flowing and challenging than most multi-class tracks. However the practicalities of taking a whole load of tyres means it's still not a viable option for me. I'd also need to get hold of an in-line chassis conversion for my faithful 12R5.1 as the additive levels get seriously high grip.

So World GT which means 13.5 blinky for the first time Thankfully I have a ROAR legal 1S LiPo (Thunder Power) and 13.5 motor (EPIC Duo 2) from last time. It's an added challenge to find LiPos and motors that are both on the ROAR and BRCA lists to avoid them being useful for only one or the other

Entries open on Thanksgiving...now to make sure I'm in the first few to enter for an engraved prize

Right we have a basic plan...things could and may yet change, but it is a start

Sorting out to run at the EPS round 17/18 December, and that will be a shakedown of something new. Will also plan to get out at one of the Ardent rounds for some blinky 13.5 action. Result at the meeting isn't top of the agenda as I'm in for F1 class, but it would help to get a base gearing and feel for 13.5 blinky.

Will mean running two cars at least one meeting. And possibly both if the F1 rules work for me at the EPS meeting.

Snowbirds is first week in Feb, so that kinda works at the moment

I have wished for an F1 at the Birds. You all know how much I enjoy World GT class, but F1 looked great fun in Vegas. It would however almost certaintly have meant a narrow UF1 class car...which is more time, money and set up work than I can reasonably fit in.

World GT it is...only the best in the US there to race against, and I know what to expect this year. Bring on the mouse ears